I support and respect law enforcement, the military, doctors and nurses and our flag.

I kneel to pray and I stand for the national anthem.

Jim Benz

Galveston

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(46) comments

Carlos Ponce

Jim Benz,[thumbup]

Ted Gillis

I whole heartedly agree Jim. I hope you and others respect another person’s right to kneel for the national anthem and to stand in silence while others pray.

They both seem like respectful gestures.

Carlos Ponce

"another person’s right to kneel for the national anthem" Why kneel at the playing of the anthem? Why not knee at the playing of their NFL team's fight song?

"Hail to the Redskins....." TAKE A KNEE!

"Miami has the Dolphins, the Greatest Football Team...." TAKE A KNEE!

Texans: "Red, white and dat blue..." TAKE A KNEE!

"Go Dallas Cowboys, go Cowboy Team...." TAKE A KNEE!

etc.

Oh, they might lose their fans? Well they're going to lose fans by taking a knee at the anthem.

Jim Forsythe

Carlos, when the NFL season starts, most likely they will not be called the Redskins..

Carlos Ponce

It's their choice, Jim.

Carlos Ponce

But since you believe in polls:

"A survey explores how Native Americans feel about the name Washington Redskins. No, it’s not that survey. This one is new."

"The majority of Native Americans still aren’t offended by the name of the Washington Redskins.

That finding is from a recent survey and — as you probably remember, even if you’ve tried to forget — falls in line with what a Washington Post poll found three years ago and an Annenberg Public Policy Center poll found 12 years before that."

"But no, both polls found 9 out of 10 Native Americans were not offended by the team’s name."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/a-survey-explores-how-native-americans-feel-about-the-name-washington-redskins-no-its-not-that-survey-this-one-is-new/2019/08/09/e38553bc-b581-11e9-8949-5f36ff92706e_story.html

So who's offended? But team owners can name themselves whatever they want.

Jim Forsythe

Changing the name will happen very shortly. At this time the final names include these names. Washington Federals/Senators, Washington Griffins, Washington Skins, Washington Red Tails/Redtails, Washington Warriors, and the Washington Generals ( from the Harlem Globetrotters, they would sell the rights to the name). It also could be some other name if a company is willing to pay for naming rights.

If they change the name they stand to make a lot of money from selling merchandise with the new name. The owner said he is trying to get approval from the NFL, the Indian nation, and the Military. Once all that is involved gives their approval, the name will be changed.

Carlos Ponce

Native Americans were asked what they thought about the name "Redskins". The word that came to mind was "Proud".

Jim Forsythe

They are not going to keep that name.

Jim Forsythe

Carlos, you are using the 2016 poll. A poll conducted in 2020 shows a shifting of the way people think.

It found that 49 percent of participants strongly agreed or agreed that the Redskins team name was offensive. 38 percent were not bothered by it. The rest of the participants were indifferent.

This polled used a random national sample of 504 Native American adults.

It goes back to why people were called redskins. It was a name given to a group of people. The use was, there goes a redskin.

If this name is so great, then Washington should change their name to the Washington Whiteskins or other names.

Also if you have a few extra millions of dollars, they are looking for people to invest as minority owners, as most of the ones that make up 40% of the minority owners want to sell.

Carlos Ponce

Actually Jim, I am using the 2019 WAPO poll. Didn't you see the date on the article, August 9, 2019? It does reference the 2016 poll which had the same results.

Please reference the poll used.

Carlos Ponce

I found a reference to the poll you cite:'

"UC Berkeley researchers said they recruited “1,000 self-identified adult Native Americans” across 50 states and representing 148 tribes using the Qualtrics online survey platform.

The study found that 49 percent of participants strongly agreed or agreed that the Redskins team name was offensive. 38 percent were not bothered by it. The rest of the participants were indifferent.

Yet again, 49 percent comes nowhere near constituting a consensus. It’s not even half.

Which is all to say, whether you want to analyze a poll, a survey or a study, the notion that “Redskins” is a horribly racist and hurtful team name is hardly the slam dunk that some would have you believe."

https://www.westernjournal.com/native-americans-feel-washington-redskins-name-might-surprised/

What does UC Berkely say?'

"Washington Redskins’ name, Native mascots offend more than previously reported" To put it simply, the 49% cited was higher than what WAPO found in 2019.

And their conclusion:

"As for ideological standpoints, progressive liberals were more likely to oppose the Redskins’ name, compared to their more conservative counterparts."

“Ultimately, our study demonstrates that people who identify most with being Native American are the ones most likely to feel harmed by the continued use of stereotypical Native American team names and mascots,” [Adrianne] Eason said. “This suggests that the debate over the continued use of Native mascots should be more closely attuned to Native American voices, particularly the voices of those who are most highly identified.”

In other words, cater to the more Liberal minded.

https://news.berkeley.edu/2020/02/04/native-mascots-survey/

Jim Forsythe

As it does not matter what a poll says, because they are going to change the name. Houston teams have changed names just as Washington baseball and basketball teams have. Many teams have changed names, and more will.

The 2016 poll and the 2019 poll you quoted are the same as to what they asked.

UC Berkeley researchers said they recruited “1,000 self-identified adult Native Americans” across 50 states and representing 148 tribes using the Qualtrics online survey platform. This is the one I used.

Another- in a study by the Center for Indigenous Peoples Studies at California State University, San Bernardino. A survey of 400 individuals, with 98 individuals positively identified as Native Americans, found that 67% agreed with the statement that "Redskins" is offensive and racist. The response from non-natives was almost the opposite, with 68% responding that the name is not offensive.

Do you think it is OK to address someone as Redskin, Whiteskin, Brownskin our other names. Most people prefer being address by the name they were given.

The Native Americans that I know, would not want to be called Redskin. They just want to be called by their given name.

Carlos Ponce

"Do you think it is OK to address someone as Redskin, Whiteskin, Brownskin our other names. Do you think it is OK to address someone as Redskin, Whiteskin, Brownskin our other names."

That's a Liberal thing to use identity politics, Jim.

Jim Forsythe

Just a question for you Carlos. Do you think it is OK to call someone a Redskin?

Do you Carlos think to call someone a Redskin is a good thing?

As I said before, it does not matter about the name change, as they will be changing the name.

Name changes are nothing new. Below are just a few that have done so. All sports have had teams change names.

History of the Wizards. In 1973, the team changed its name to the Capital Bullets to reflect their move to the Washington metropolitan area, and then to Washington Bullets in the following season. In 1997, they rebranded themselves as the Wizards.

History of the Astros. On Dec. 1, 1964, the Houston Colt.45s officially changed the name of the team to the Houston Astros

Carlos Ponce

"Do you think it is OK to call someone a Redskin?"

Do you think it is OK to call someone a Raider?

Do you think it is OK to call someone a Packer?

Do you think it is OK to call someone a Buccaneer?

Do you think it is OK to call someone a Ram?

Do you think it is OK to call someone a Viking?

And going back to the NFL team in Canton, Ohio -

Do you think it is OK to call someone a Bulldog?

Do you think it is OK to call someone a Cowboy?

Do you think it is OK to call someone a Dolphin?

Do you think it is OK to call someone a Wolverine?

What about Tarheels, Gobblers, Sandcrab, Awesome Blossoms, Battlin' Bather, Robstown Texas Cotton Picker, Yuma AZ Criminals, etc.

When you play for a team you get called that mascot.

Locally we have Stingarees, Cougars, Gators, Indians, Bulldogs, Cardinals, Buccaneers, Golden Tornados, Wildcats.

Hitchcock Cheerleader chant: "How does it feel to be a BULLDOG, BULLDOG! How does it feel to be UP SO HIGH!"

Do players at Hitchcock object to being called BULLDOGS? NO!

Gary Scoggin

I do draw the line at calling someone a Texas Ranger. It’s a shame the name of that fine law enforcement organization gets sullied by that bunch of scrubs up in Arlington. 😁

Jim Forsythe

"Do you think it is OK to call someone a Redskin? Of all the mascots you listed, which one refers to the taking of scalps?

Here is a quote from a member of the Smithsonian – Kevin Gover, a member of the Pawnee Nation of Oklahoma and director of the Institution's National Museum of the American Indian:

"I'm really not that interested in where the word comes from," Gover said. "I know how it was used. And it's been used in a disparaging way for at least a couple of centuries. Up to and including the time I was growing up in Oklahoma."

What is germane to the conversation? What is semantics? That is debatable. The fact remains that to many Native Americans, the term "redskin" has long meant the act of our ancestor's scalps being collected for bounty. "

The kind of bounty that was referenced above, was referenced in the 1755 Phips Proclamation.

The Phips Proclamation promised a bounty to be paid by the colonial government for every Penobscot Indian captured and brought to Boston. Bounty hunters were paid 50 pounds for living captive Penobscot males 12 years and older, 40 pounds for the scalps of dead Penobscot males age 12 and over, 25 pounds for the scalps of women, and 20 pounds for the scalps of children under the age of 12. The average annual salary of a teacher during this period was between 60 – 120 pounds. Wiscasset was in the District of Maine, which together with parts of New Hampshire and Nova Scotia, were located in the Province of Massachusetts Bay.

The Phips Proclamation of 1755 contributed to the annihilation of the Wabanaki Confederacy, which formerly included between 16 and 30 tribes. Only four tribes remain today in Maine.

If you think the Phips Proclamation was OK then I guess you think the trail of tears was just a walk. Once a person knows the history of why something is offensive to a group and continues to use it, it is now on them.

Carlos Ponce

Scalps were taken by both sides, Jim regardless of ethnicity.

"On November 29, 1864, the Colorado territory militia responded to a series of Indian attacks on white settlements by attacking a Cheyenne and Arapaho encampment on Sand Creek in southeastern Colorado, under orders to take no prisoners. The militia killed about 200 of the Indians, two-thirds of whom were women and children, taking scalps and other grisly trophies of battle."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Indian_Wars

Jim Forsythe

Once a person knows the history of why something is offensive to a group and continues to use it, it is now on them!

Carlos Ponce

What constitutes offensive? The majority according to the UC Berkely study found no offense. Those that did were Liberal. The WAPO 2016 and 2019 polls found no offense. By the way, UC Berkely study was published in Feb 2020.

Jim Forsythe

The Native Americans whose ancestors were murdered, find it offensive. Tribes that were almost hunted to the point of no longer being, find it offensive.

Why is it so important to you that they keep that name? Are you a fan of Washingtons' football team? If not, why are you trying so hard to justify why they should keep that name. It's their team and they can name it anything they want, as long as it is approved by the league. Will it change anything in your life when the team changes the name?

A bigger story than this is the Raiders are going to be in Vegas.

Carlos Ponce

It's a privately owned team that can name their team whatever they want. I don't like the heavy handed way they are going about it with false narratives. It is blackmail.

Jim Forsythe

Dan Snyder will decide when they change the name and what they change it to. It is possible that he may sell the team and the person most say would be in line to buy them is Jeff Bezos. This is one thing that could slow the name changing as a new owner would want to be the one to name the team.

Dan Snyder paid $800 million for the team in 2000 and now he will get about $2.95 billion for them if he sells them.

Washingtons revenue per year is about $491 million and operating income is about $122 million a year.

Just as always, it is about money.

Charles Douglas

So do I Mr. Benz, So do I.....

Jose' Boix

Right on point, Mr. Benz! God Bless America, and my personal thanks to this Great Country!

Gary Miller

I'll watch college football. The NFL says they will kneel for the national anthem Making it worse they plan on playing the BLM anthem before each game. Let's see if BLM can fill the stands or sustain profitable TV ratings.

Charles Douglas

Mr. Miller> i don't blame you! I would not walk across the street to see a pro game if they let me in free! Now that Roger G. is messing it up the way he is, I'll boycott it on TV too! High School and College is my passion anyway! Why GDN, use to have a Friday Night Program where the County fans, could hear updates on multiple school games taking place for those who could not attend. OG (s) Gary Scoggin and

PONCE, and Gray from Santa Fe are familiar with all this! When Texas City played LaMarque, or when one of them took on on the Ball High Tors,.......IT WAS TIME FOR SOME FOOTBALL ... in this county!

Martin Connor

And i must say JBG-you are one of the best and most loyal HS sports fans in Galveston county. Smack talker extraordinaire. I miss the days of your smack talking posts.

Charles Douglas

Aaaaaah! It is a treat that others remember the good old days Mr. Connor! It looks as though those football times we enjoyed have like the great horse culture of the plains, and the western frontier, passed on Into history! Good thing We had fun though! I miss those times when we could gather on this forum on game nights with fans from all the schools here, with a GDN moderator, picking up scores, and announcements from everywhere! That was football There!

Gary Scoggin

Gary Miller - I didn’t know there was such a thing as the BLM anthem. If you mean “Lift Every Voice and Sing”, that is a hymn written around 1900 based on a passage from Exodus. It is often called the “Black National Anthem.” It’s a beautiful song, by the way.

I’ll leave it to the MAGA snowflakes to get offended by a song sung before a football game.

Jim Forsythe

GaryScoggin, people that are upset about a song being played, probably do not watch or go to pro games.

I have been to highschool games that played America the beautiful and it was nice. Music is just that, music.

I have been to flag raisings that did not include the pledge that was a very nice ceremony.

The reason the NFL will still have large TV ratings is gambling on the games. A lot of people watch because they have money on the games.

Carlos Ponce

When Jim was in school the high school band played "Dixie"."Music is just that, music." And wasn't the Senior Prom theme "The Old South"?

Jim Forsythe

What your point? I have not idea what the Senior Prom theme was because I did not go. I will have to take your word on it, as you must have gone to Texas City's prom. Altoona High School did not play "Dixie". I do not know if Mr. Renfro had Texas City play "Dixie".

Music and the reaction to it have changed since 1971. Music is just music. The exception would be a song like "Strange Fruit".

Carlos Ponce

Didn't go to the prom you say. That's okay. But the TCHS Band did play "Dixie". Last I heard them (earlier this century) they still played the opening notes to "Dixie" at the end of the TCHS fight song played to the tune of "Our Director". And those who heard LMHS Cougar band under Wendel Tilford heard "Dixie" played earlier this century.

Jim Forsythe

What your point?

Carlos Ponce

"What's your 'point'? " You seem to abhor things associated with the Old South but most don't mind "Dixie" being played in this area. Just wondering, does "Dixie" offend Jim Forsythe, a song that was played at his high school back in the day and in the modern era?

Here is the Texas City School song and fight song in 2014:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yd8ALavUJdg

You can hear "Dixie" (at 2:00) at the end of "Our Director" Fight Song, only the first notes, but back in your day they played the entire song.

And here's Bob Renfroe directing an alumni band. Can you name that tune?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHqvYV4aeo0

Jim Forsythe

Many songs share parts of other songs, especially High Scool songs. Altoona stole their whole music including words to their fight song, from Notre Dame and it did not make us Irish. A few notes do not make a song. None of your links exposed TCHS playing Dixie in the whole, just a few notes. If you think they did, good for you. If they had played the whole song with singing, so what. Why would you think that I did not like the TCHS fight song?

You must really like the song "Dixie", as you keep bringing it up Some of my favorite music comes from the south.

The only songs I talked about in this posting was America the beautiful and "Strange Fruit".

"What's your 'point'?

Carlos Ponce

Point already posted.

Carlos Ponce

"Altoona stole their whole music including words to their fight song..." By the way, Jim, no school "steals" songs. A large amount of a school's band budget goes to buying musical arrangements for each instrument and with that music comes the legal rights for public performance. The Notre Dame Fight Song is used by many high schools, locally the O'Connell Buccaneers. Hitchcock uses "Washington and Lee Swing" for their fight song which comes from Washington and Lee University. The HHS school song is sung to "The Sweetheart of Sigma Chi" and that fraternity owns the copyright. Even for a song like "Star Spangled Banner" a school pays for an arrangement of that tune. So if any school chooses to add "Lift Every Voice and Sing" to their band's repertoire the school must pay to play.

Jim Forsythe

Altoona did not pay for the rights, as we were a small school with no money. The music we used was run off on a mimeograph machine of some sort.

We never had store-bought sheet music. If you do not purchase the music, no payments paid. No one is going after a school that had less than 50 students in high school and has no money. Altoona combined with Midway, so they no longer play that song.

So what is your point?

You go on about how I must dislike southern music, which you have no bases to say. For some reason, you think I dislike the song "Dixie", which I do not.

Carlos Ponce

Public performance songs must be paid for. If it was black ink it was mimeographed. If it was a purplish hue it was spirit duplicated aka ditto copies. Chances are the director bought a set and spirit duplicated them in that time period (1960s), keeping the original set on file. Now if he "borrowed" a set from another school and duplicated it - that was illegal.

Charles Douglas

We played " Night Train" at LaMarque back in the day when The Ball High Tors came storming into LaMarque with the Best defense in the state! It was in the mid seventies, and Ball had a big super strong All-State Linebacker name James Yarborough, who is the Mayor Of Galevston Now! Anyway there was a radio personality named Woody Carson, who was interviewing LaMarque's head coach on the radio, while I was driving to the game. He said, "Coach....... ......, you bringing your district leading Cougars into ETHEREDGE Stadium tonight against the Ball High Tors, who sports the number one defense in the State." "COACH, what do you have to say?" Coach: "Well Woody, we gonna dance with who BRUNG US!" " Three things can happen when you pass the football, and two of them are bad!" "We ...WILL... RUN...the football!" Lololo, I said to myself we just LOST this game! When LM lined up against BH, Yarbrough & the other LB(S) were playing up with the down linemen! I remember grabbing my face with both hands saying loudly, " DAT FOOL!!!" It was that kind of game until the LM QB for some reason in the third quarter ...on his own volition, changed a running play to a quick pass over Yarborough to the LM Tight End, and it went Forty yards for a TD! That play rallied the Cougars to get with it! We won 14-12 but I heard the QB got a butt chewing for changing that play! Finally Big Bill Bundy came to town and things began to change! Later Hugh Massey, then the Great One, Allan Waddell!

James Woodall

Gary Scoggin Jul 6, 2020 3:32pm

I do draw the line at calling someone a Texas Ranger. It’s a shame the name of that fine law enforcement organization gets sullied by that bunch of scrubs up in Arlington. 😁.............THAT IS SO FUNNY!

Ted Gillis

Memeogragh! I remember those kind of handouts in school. Once the teacher handed those to us we would hold them up to our face to smell the fresh ammonia ink smell. What fools we were. Carlos, maybe that’s what’s wrong with us.

Carlos Ponce

That's not a mimeograph, Ted, that's a copy made with a spirit duplicator aka ditto sheets. The "spirit" was alcohol based. Students smelling papers was common as illustrated on "Fast Times at Ridgemont High" when Mr. Hand (Ray Walston) passed out papers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uu3iCvAQCHg

As master copy was made using a three piece ditto sheet.

First, remove the protector sheet.

Second, By typing or writing on the top sheet, some ink was transferred to it .

Third, separate the two sheets

Fourth, place the sheet on a spirit duplicator drum. There were two types of machines, some were hand cranked, others were electric. As the drum spun it passed by the alcohol which dissolved part of the ink which transferred onto the copy.

As master could also be made using thermal transfer if the ink on the original was carbon based.

Mimeographs used an ink tank forcing ink through a stencil onto a copy.

Spirit duplicators used an alcohol tank (the smell) which transferred the ink left on a spirit master to the copy.

People who once used mimeographs used the same term to refer to a spirit duplicator even though they are not the same. It's like calling a refrigerator an ice box or a pen a quill.

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