A natural question

Registered nurse Jeri Jaquis fills a syringe with a dose of the Moderna COVID-19 vaccine at a mass vaccination site at the Galveston County Health District offices in Texas City on Wednesday, Aug. 18, 2021. There’s evidence that having survived COVID infection confers some protection against reinfection, but health professionals still urge vaccination and warn that relying natural immunity is a high-stakes gamble.

As the COVID pandemic approaches its 20th month, exact answers about how well natural immunity conferred by infection works to prevent reinfection remain elusive. Although experts now say previously infected people might be protected, many still consider vaccinations the best protection and the best path to take.

The Question of the Week is: How do you feel about natural immunity against COVID?

• If I survived COVID, I would still get vaccinated to optimize my protection.

• If I survived COVID, I would feel adequately protected and wouldn't get vaccinated.

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(43) comments

Joan Carlin

Rather than only having a question asking people how they “feel” about a vaccine after contracting Covid, I suggest the newspaper could also provide a public service by actually reporting an article about what we KNOW from science about this topic. The question alone doesn’t help educate the public. This misses an opportunity to get rid of some of the misinformation out there.

Gary Scoggin

How I “feel” is irrelevant. What matters is how the virus behaves in the presence of any naturally occurring antibodies.

It is not surprising that we are getting differing answers as there is much research being conducted according to a variety of research protocols. These things take time to sort out. What is unequivocally true is that those who have been vaccinated have a significantly lower probability of a serious or fatal course of any subsequent Covid infections. That, along with the low rate of adverse reactions, leads me to believe the vaccinations are a good thing. Any additional protection due to acquired immunity is just icing on the cake.

Bailey Jones

Joan and Gary beat me to it.

Paul Steele

Please get the VAX for the TEAM

Carlos Ponce

What TEAM? TEAM Biden? TEAM Big Pharma?

When there are less obtrusive, effective prophylactics available, why?

(Clue the Lib%&#$% who use propaganda not SCIENCE to downplay these prophylactics.)

I have a friend who had the Chinese Virus. They wanted to intubate him. He declined. His personal physician was able to obtain Ivermectin which is hard to get because of Lib%&#$% propaganda. After that, he was out and about, ready to get back to work. I just spoke with a healthcare provider who works at the UTMB Galveston pandemic unit. They are using Ivermectin in "clinical studies" at Jennie Sealy. But they keep it quiet because of Lib%&#$% propaganda citing only one use of the drug calling it "horse worm medicine".

Jim Forsythe

How did the conversation go from “I’m not worried about COVID, it’s only the flu” to “yeah give me some deworming medicine”.

At first the argument against getting vaccinated was that the vaccines weren’t FDA approved. But now that the Pfizer vaccine has full FDA approval, soon to be followed by full approval for Moderna and J&J, and 386 million of Americans have been vaccinated with them, people are instead rushing to take a horse dewormer? Sure invermectin also used in humans- in to treat head lice, or if you are unlucky enough to have intestinal worms. Oh right, they “did their research” on the internet and there is this one study that shows it kills the virus in test tubes. Gasoline will kill cancer cells in a petri dish. That doesn't mean cancer patients would benefit from ingesting gasoline.

Ivermectin tablets are approved for use in humans for the treatment of some parasitic worms (intestinal strongyloidiasis and onchocerciasis) and ivermectin topical formulations are approved for human use by prescription only for the treatment of external parasites such as headlice and for skin conditions such as rosacea.

Gary Scoggin

Just another day in the MAGAverse

Carlos Ponce

Gary Scoggin, what you call MAGAverse, the rest of us call reality.

Gary Scoggin

A witty retort. It’s too bad you are not eligible for the daily “Carlos Ponce Award for Thoughtful Discourse.”

Carlos Ponce

So now, Jim thinks he knows more than the medical staff at UTMB.

To quote Dr. Rand Paul, "you’re not a medical doctor."

Mary Gillespie

Jim, about 20% of prescriptions are written for "off-label" use: that is, these drugs are prescribed for illnesses other than that for which the FDA approved the drug's use. Both my children's lives were saved by off-label use of a prescription drug.

Gary Scoggin

Mary, I have no personal knowledge about Ivermectin, but you are right about off label use. But, as you note, only under the care of a physician.

Jim Forsythe

Mary, as you know it is very important to work with your Doctor, to make sure you understand all the possible side effects, and how to use a off label medicine. One of my family members must use a off label drug, and must be careful for side effects and works with the Doctor, for the drug they use.

Part of the problem with Ivermectin is that there is not a agreed dose that needs to be used for Covid19. Ivermectin has many side effects that a user needs to understand. If your Doctor agrees that Ivermectin is right for you, be perspired for questions from your Pharmacist.

Pharmacist John Vinson: "If we start to see danger, like we did with opioids and benzodiazepines in recent years, then we could start to see more and more pharmacists that may refuse to fill a prescription based on what they feel is a danger to the patient," Vinson said. "Some of the treatment doses for ivermectin are higher doses than what is normal for other infections, and so then you get concerned about potential overdose or potential adverse effects that don't show up at the lower doses."

Carlos Ponce

"Part of the problem with Ivermectin is that there is not a agreed dose that needs to be used for Covid19. "

"Standard Dose Ivermectin for COVID-19"

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8097313/

Jim Forsythe

Carlos, it's a clinical trial that you posted about. The last statement in your link says it all. "Ivermectin is being used already in an uncontrolled way in Latin American countries." We do not need an improper use of the drug to be further promoted, unless well-designed randomized controlled trials will be able to prove an efficacy, presumably with the use of much higher doses of ivermectin."

As I said, Part of the problem with Ivermectin is that there is not a agreed dose that needs to be used for Covid19.

Carlos, your link also said.

"We currently are coordinating a randomized, Phase 2, double-blind clinical trial."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8097313/

It is very important to work with your Doctor, to make sure you understand all the possible side effects, and how to use a off label medicine, such as Ivermectin for Covid19 .

Carlos Ponce

The link was posted back in May, almost 5 months ago. I gave you a FACTUAL update.

Jim Forsythe

Nice update Carlos, "Standard Dose Ivermectin for COVID-19".

Carlos Ponce

The update was the use of Ivermectin in UTMB Galveston.

Jim Forsythe

Carlos, what they are doing at Jennie Sealy, are clinical studies. They are not going to recommend dosage for the public, if ever, until the clinical studies are over. Part of the problem with Ivermectin, is that there is not a agreed dose, that needs to be used for Covid19.

As you said, "They are using Ivermectin in "clinical studies" at Jennie Sealy."

Talk to your Doctor before using Ivermectin, for Covid19.

Carlos Ponce

That doesn't matter, Jim. What matters is UTMB is using Ivermectin to save lives.

Jim Forsythe

Carlos, it's a clinical study. They are not suggesting dose amount for anyone, but for people in their study. The outcome may be that they determine that the risk reward of Ivermectin for Covid19, is in the negative. Until the results of the studies are complete, they will not be prescribing Ivermectin to the general public. Also the results may be negative for using Ivermectin at the levels required.

Carlos, are you sure that all of UTMB is using Ivermectin or is it limited to the Jennie Sealy clinical studies?

Talk to your Doctor before using Ivermectin, for Covid19.

Carlos Ponce

"Carlos, are you sure that all of UTMB is using Ivermectin or is it limited to the Jennie Sealy clinical studies?"

Is there a difference?

Carlos Ponce

Jennie Sealy is a UTMB Hospital. From my understanding they are using Ivermectin for some pandemic patients. The person I spoke with is assigned to several UTMB Hospitals. My understanding is use of Ivermectin is not restricted to the Jennie Sealy Campus.

Jim Forsythe

Just as always, you have just spoke with a healthcare provider or other people that are involved in what ever we are talking about. Never names, but just some mysterious person who works at the UTMB Galveston pandemic unit.

"clinical studies" are just that, studies that are just part of the process. Until the "clinical studies" and the rest of the studies are complete and proven that Ivermectin is safe and works for covid19, a person should not be taking Ivermectin for Covid19. Unless a Doctor prescribes it, it should not be used.. Ivermectin should only used for what it prescribed for.

Carlos, you are pushing for a drug, Ivermectin to be used for Covid19, which is not a approved use.

Carlos Ponce

Non-doctor Jim Forsythe giving medical advice?

Jim Forsythe

No Carlos, saying to take Ivermectin as prescribed by a Doctor, is not playing Doctor.

Telling people to take Ivermectin for Covid19, is playing Doctor. Using Ivermectin for Covid19, is not a approved use. Ivermectin can be used in humans- to treat head lice, or intestinal worms, if prescribed by a Doctor.

Carlos Ponce

Those "Telling people to take Ivermectin for Covid19" ARE DOCTORS, Jim.

Jim Forsythe

Doctors prescribing Ivermectin is one thing, but people that are not Doctors, and using it on themselves, is wrong.

People are buying Ivermectin from the feed store, and using it in a manor it is intendent to be used.

Carlos Ponce

No one ever posted or said to self-medicate, Jim.

Gary Scoggin

This conversation makes me want to self-medicate with ethanol.

Carlos Ponce

From NIH.gov:

"Background:

Repurposed medicines may have a role against the SARS-CoV-2 virus. The antiparasitic ivermectin, with antiviral and anti-inflammatory properties, has now been tested in numerous clinical trials.

Conclusions:

Moderate-certainty evidence finds that large reductions in COVID-19 deaths are possible using ivermectin. Using ivermectin early in the clinical course may reduce numbers progressing to severe disease. The apparent safety and low cost suggest that ivermectin is likely to have a significant impact on the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic globally."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8248252/

Key words: SAFETY and LOW COST

Jim Forsythe

Ivermectin is not approved for the treatment of COVID-19. Any use by humans for Covid19, should be approved by their Doctors.

Trials are just one step in the approval process.

Carlos Ponce

Ivermectin is being prescribed by DOCTORS, Jim. No one ever posted or suggested otherwise.

Charlotte O'rourke

To me, where I disconnect with anti-vaccine sentiment is the willingness to try different “repurposed” medications ..... instead of just getting the vaccine which though not 100% effective is still better than the odds without the vaccine.

Proactive (vaccinations) versus reactive (let me try that placebo or repurposed medication or ?) to see if I can live.

If you are lucky enough to have great “genes” to be asymptotic good for you, but different individuals react differently and at this time, it is not known exactly why or what reaction covid will produce. The best treatment regimen to prevent death and long term complications from covid is still being determined so I will take the experts best advice and get the vaccinations.

Charlotte O'rourke

asymptomatic

Ted Gillis

Which DOCTORS, Carlos? Dr. Stella Emmanuel, the Demon Semen doctor?

Lisa Marie

My 84 yo mom had Covid over a year ago. Hospital with Resmedovir (anti viral) IV drip for 5 days. Just had her antibodies tested because she has been relentlessly pressured to get the vaccine. Guess what? Antibodies are high and robust a YEAR later. C'mon man. You know natural immunity is far superior. It's nature!

Gary Scoggin

To GCDN Staff…..

You knew you were throwing chum out to the sharks when you published this question, didn’t you?

Gary Miller

Vaccines are prefered by people earning their living selling vaccines.If selling masks they think masks should be required. People treating the covid are reporting natural immunity is 6 to 27 times better than three shots+booster. Vaccine immunity will likely require three shots+ booster again next year and every NEXT year.

Dan Freeman

Experts warn against using ivermectin to treat COVID

By EMMA COLLINS The Daily News Sep 8, 2021 65

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Experts are warning county residents not to use ivermectin to treat COVID as sales of the anti-parasitic medicine rise in the county.

The drug, which is commonly used as a dewormer in animals such as horses and cows, has been touted as an at-home cure for COVID and is being purchased at higher rates from livestock feed stores.

But little research supports the claim ivermectin is effective in treating COVID, said Mark Winter, managing director at the Southeast Texas Poison Center. And although ivermectin also exists for humans, the type sold at feed stores for large animals is different and the dosing much greater, leading to a risk of poisoning or overdose, he said.

The poison hotline has seen a 116 percent increase in calls relating to ivermectin in 2021 and received more than 50 calls from Aug. 25 to Sept. 3, he said. Many of the recent calls have come from hospitals, with patients ending up there after ingesting too much of the drug, he said.

“They’ve gone to the feed store, and they’ve found ivermectin paste for the treatment of horses up to 1,250 pounds,” he said. “And in that little tube, that’s got the equivalent of 30 doses for somebody that might weigh 200 pounds.”

The increase in poison calls about ivermectin has been seen across the country. In July, there were 133 calls nationwide related to the drug, according to the National Poison Data System, which collects data from the country’s 55 poison control centers. That number rose to 459 in August, an increase of 245 percent.

The increased use prompted the U.S. Food and Drug Administration to issue an additional warning against using the drug.

“You are not a horse. You are not a cow. Seriously, y’all. Stop it,” the organization tweeted Aug. 21.

WHAT IS IVERMECTIN?

Ivermectin is used in animals as a deworming medicine, retired veterinarian Jackie Cole said. And although it’s effective at ridding animals of parasites, that application requires careful dosing, she said.

But the drug can also be used in humans as an anti-parasitic, Winter said. It’s approved in low doses for use in humans to kill the worms that cause river blindness, reducing some of the damage, and to treat roundworm. Some topical forms can also be used to treat head lice and rosacea, according to the FDA.

The ivermectin used in animals and humans is not the same, however.

In addition to the different dosage for humans and animals, the drugs also have different active ingredients, according to the FDA. The type of ivermectin used in animals also contains inactive ingredients that haven’t been studied in people.

“People should never take animal drugs, as the FDA has only evaluated their safety and effectiveness in the particular species for which they are labeled,” Steven Solomon, director of the FDA’s Center for Veterinary Medicine, said in an April 10, 2020, letter to stakeholders.

“Using these products in humans could cause serious harm.”

https://www.galvnews.com/news/free/article_3a3389cf-6a5d-5114-8e24-0fa75c6f3ba3.html

No named physician at UTMB has recommended the use of ivermectin. Writers who say otherwise are liars or Russian trolls.

Carlos Ponce

"No named physician at UTMB has recommended the use of ivermectin."

Ivermectin is being used at UTMB, Dan. That's a FACT. Don't you have any connections at UTMB to CHECK or are you upset they won't talk to you?

Dan Freeman

It is being tested not prescribed. Name one physician who prescribes it. He or she will be fired.

Carlos Ponce

Sooooo, Dan admits UTMB is using Ivermectin! If they have to say "being tested" to use it that's no problem. Ask any physician. They are PRACTICING Medicine.[beam]

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